T Campbell's Blog
Writer of Penny and Aggie, Fans (also called Faans), Rip & Teri, Search Engine Funnies and A History of Webcomics. Experienced webcomics editor, currently seeking full-time work and working on strange and interesting new things...Thursday, December 08, 2005
What It Means To Write: Why Every Webcartoonist Needs To Use OhNoRobot
Let's clear this up, here.
OhNoRobot, the webcomics search engine, is not just a cool little tool that you'll rule if you stay in school.
OhNoRobot is my attempt to counter what I see as the single biggest threat to webcomics in 2006.
Jim Keplinger feels that the nature of art and writing has changed thanks to "instant publishing." Nowadays it's not just about the freedom to speak, it's about the ability to be heard. If a blog post never gets read, does it make a sound?
Anyone who cares about reaching their intended audience has to try to make their thoughts available. You have to jack in. You can't just hope that "if you build it, they will come."
If you make a comic and put it on the Web, it's because you want that comic to be read. And if a comic deserves to be read, it deserves to be found. Especially by people who are looking for something like it. It deserves to be searched. If it can't be searched, a feeling of futility condenses in the air.
And webcomics have a serious searchability deficit.
Google is comics-illiterate.
If text is entered into an Illustrator file that then becomes a word balloon, Google can't read it. Neither can Yahoo, MSN or Ask Jeeves.
If you're a publisher of webcomics about granny clothes, Google Ads will likely assign you advertising about comic books, not about clothes.
If you're a longtime reader of a strip like Penny Arcade and you want to pull up their strip about the Eisners, you've got a decent chance of finding it, as long as you can figure out the approach Tycho takes to the blog. But if you want to find the strip in which the orcs are playing CTF, good luck. If you want to find the one where Tycho sues the nation of France, well, I want a pony.
Penny Arcade does have a search service of its own, but at this writing, for its comics, it's even worse. Try searching for France or CTF or the Eisners on this.
Now suppose you're a new cartoonist and you want to make a comic about zombies. But first you want to check out the other comics about zombies to see if you're really bringing anything new to the table. You might find Eric Maziade's Zombies or Robert Kirkman and Tony Moore's print Walking Dead, but unless you see this post or the interview I did with Joey Manley, you likely won't know about the touching zombie plot in Scary-Go-Round, or "28 Geeks Later," the snarky escape story from Sluggy Freelance.
Now, let's suppose you're considering ending your life.
Before you do, I want you to be able to see this. And this. And if earnest treatments don't do it for you, I'd also like you to see Randy Milholland's darkly wry acknowledgement of his own fleeting impulses. The first strip says, "Look at what you may leave behind." The last two say, "You are not alone."
I KIND OF THINK IT'S A LITTLE IMPORTANT THAT THESE KINDS OF THOUGHTS DON'T GET LOST IN THE FOG.
Cartoonists, your work is worth being seen. OhNoRobot is dedicated to letting more people see it. And we have designed our system to overcome every objection we can think of.
"But I'm building my own search solution."
We share back what the community shares with us. Sign up with us and you get full access to your data, which you can use to build and update your own private search engine. Or you can link to an advanced search algorithm on our site, just for your strip.
"I already have a search engine."
Then let us import the data so that we can make sure as many people see your words as possible-- not just the ones who already go to your private site. You can get us to export that data, along with any additional data we've gathered, back to you with a click of a mouse!
"My search engine features more than simple transcriptions."
Congratulations! We have plans to expand the features that we offer in the coming year, and may add some of yours. But no matter what, your comic should be represented in an engine that people will use to find new comics.
"Most of the time, my comic doesn't have any words."
In extreme cases like that, we will take summaries in lieu of transcriptions.
"Doesn't that lend itself to abuse? Could some cartoonist keyword-stuff his transcriptions?"
This hasn't happened yet, but there's always the possibility. When we spot troublemakers, we'll warn them first, and try to clear up any misunderstanding. If they're still are trying to break the site, we'll simply drop them from the index page. They'll still have their information in their own search engine for their comic, but their results won't show up in searches across comic series.
"In the suicide comics you mention above, only one of them uses the word 'suicide' in the dialogue. How would transcribing the other two help?"
Firstly, not everyone who searches for suicide searches for the exact keyword "suicide." Secondly, transcriptions are the backbone of our service, but as we grow, we'll be investigating other means of finding comics.
"What about other search solutions like OnlineComics.net, the Secret Comics Database, Comixpedia.org and even Full Story?"
We do not compete with other search solutions. We work with them, we help them and let them help us. But we are determined to push further than any of them. We have accepted that we will never include every comic-- but we will not be satisfied until we have become the webcomics Google.
"All those comics? Won't some of them refuse?"
That's why we keep overcoming objections! And if there's an objection I've neglected here that we can't overcome with reason, we'll overcome it with technology.
"Are you going to exploit me?"
"Are you going to make no money and abandon this project in three months?"
OhNoRobot will be a business. The site will become self-sufficient. But first and foremost, our focus is your comic and your search results. This is more than a business. It's a CAUSE. And how we conduct ourselves will reflect that.
Our mission is to provide information about the world's webcomics in order to make them easier to read and discover.
I am a zealot about this. By now, that should be clear.
"How can I help?"
Visit your favorite comic, see if they're on Oh No Robot, and if yes, start transcribing! (If no, tell them they should be!) On each transcription page you'll also see a list of comics for the series that need transcribing. You can direct your efforts where they're needed most.
If you want to discuss the project and its futunre, sign up for our new Yahoo mailgroup!
And if you're a cartoonist, read more... or just sign up for the service and put the code on your page. We'll all be glad you did.
All of us.
OhNoRobot, the webcomics search engine, is not just a cool little tool that you'll rule if you stay in school.
OhNoRobot is my attempt to counter what I see as the single biggest threat to webcomics in 2006.
Jim Keplinger feels that the nature of art and writing has changed thanks to "instant publishing." Nowadays it's not just about the freedom to speak, it's about the ability to be heard. If a blog post never gets read, does it make a sound?
Anyone who cares about reaching their intended audience has to try to make their thoughts available. You have to jack in. You can't just hope that "if you build it, they will come."
If you make a comic and put it on the Web, it's because you want that comic to be read. And if a comic deserves to be read, it deserves to be found. Especially by people who are looking for something like it. It deserves to be searched. If it can't be searched, a feeling of futility condenses in the air.
And webcomics have a serious searchability deficit.
Google is comics-illiterate.
If text is entered into an Illustrator file that then becomes a word balloon, Google can't read it. Neither can Yahoo, MSN or Ask Jeeves.
If you're a publisher of webcomics about granny clothes, Google Ads will likely assign you advertising about comic books, not about clothes.
If you're a longtime reader of a strip like Penny Arcade and you want to pull up their strip about the Eisners, you've got a decent chance of finding it, as long as you can figure out the approach Tycho takes to the blog. But if you want to find the strip in which the orcs are playing CTF, good luck. If you want to find the one where Tycho sues the nation of France, well, I want a pony.
Penny Arcade does have a search service of its own, but at this writing, for its comics, it's even worse. Try searching for France or CTF or the Eisners on this.
Now suppose you're a new cartoonist and you want to make a comic about zombies. But first you want to check out the other comics about zombies to see if you're really bringing anything new to the table. You might find Eric Maziade's Zombies or Robert Kirkman and Tony Moore's print Walking Dead, but unless you see this post or the interview I did with Joey Manley, you likely won't know about the touching zombie plot in Scary-Go-Round, or "28 Geeks Later," the snarky escape story from Sluggy Freelance.
Now, let's suppose you're considering ending your life.
Before you do, I want you to be able to see this. And this. And if earnest treatments don't do it for you, I'd also like you to see Randy Milholland's darkly wry acknowledgement of his own fleeting impulses. The first strip says, "Look at what you may leave behind." The last two say, "You are not alone."
I KIND OF THINK IT'S A LITTLE IMPORTANT THAT THESE KINDS OF THOUGHTS DON'T GET LOST IN THE FOG.
Cartoonists, your work is worth being seen. OhNoRobot is dedicated to letting more people see it. And we have designed our system to overcome every objection we can think of.
"But I'm building my own search solution."
We share back what the community shares with us. Sign up with us and you get full access to your data, which you can use to build and update your own private search engine. Or you can link to an advanced search algorithm on our site, just for your strip.
"I already have a search engine."
Then let us import the data so that we can make sure as many people see your words as possible-- not just the ones who already go to your private site. You can get us to export that data, along with any additional data we've gathered, back to you with a click of a mouse!
"My search engine features more than simple transcriptions."
Congratulations! We have plans to expand the features that we offer in the coming year, and may add some of yours. But no matter what, your comic should be represented in an engine that people will use to find new comics.
"Most of the time, my comic doesn't have any words."
In extreme cases like that, we will take summaries in lieu of transcriptions.
"Doesn't that lend itself to abuse? Could some cartoonist keyword-stuff his transcriptions?"
This hasn't happened yet, but there's always the possibility. When we spot troublemakers, we'll warn them first, and try to clear up any misunderstanding. If they're still are trying to break the site, we'll simply drop them from the index page. They'll still have their information in their own search engine for their comic, but their results won't show up in searches across comic series.
"In the suicide comics you mention above, only one of them uses the word 'suicide' in the dialogue. How would transcribing the other two help?"
Firstly, not everyone who searches for suicide searches for the exact keyword "suicide." Secondly, transcriptions are the backbone of our service, but as we grow, we'll be investigating other means of finding comics.
"What about other search solutions like OnlineComics.net, the Secret Comics Database, Comixpedia.org and even Full Story?"
We do not compete with other search solutions. We work with them, we help them and let them help us. But we are determined to push further than any of them. We have accepted that we will never include every comic-- but we will not be satisfied until we have become the webcomics Google.
"All those comics? Won't some of them refuse?"
That's why we keep overcoming objections! And if there's an objection I've neglected here that we can't overcome with reason, we'll overcome it with technology.
"Are you going to exploit me?"
"Are you going to make no money and abandon this project in three months?"
OhNoRobot will be a business. The site will become self-sufficient. But first and foremost, our focus is your comic and your search results. This is more than a business. It's a CAUSE. And how we conduct ourselves will reflect that.
Our mission is to provide information about the world's webcomics in order to make them easier to read and discover.
I am a zealot about this. By now, that should be clear.
"How can I help?"
Visit your favorite comic, see if they're on Oh No Robot, and if yes, start transcribing! (If no, tell them they should be!) On each transcription page you'll also see a list of comics for the series that need transcribing. You can direct your efforts where they're needed most.
If you want to discuss the project and its futunre, sign up for our new Yahoo mailgroup!
And if you're a cartoonist, read more... or just sign up for the service and put the code on your page. We'll all be glad you did.
All of us.
Comments:
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I got a lot of wordy comics, my fans aint obssesive enough to do it for me, and I'm lazy. Is there a way to half-ass it?
You could always ask for volunteers, and e-mail them cutesy thankyou pictures afterwards (resolution proportional to the amount transcribed divided by the number of typos).
Do you write scripts on a word processor?
If you replace page numbers with the URLs of the corresponding strips and send it to me, we can probably work from that.
If you replace page numbers with the URLs of the corresponding strips and send it to me, we can probably work from that.
Some quick points in response to an e-mail from Nicolas Juzda:
Transcriptions are useful guides to a webcomic's content but nothing like the experience of actually reading one, and we make no more claims to copyright than Google does when it indexes a site. So you risk nothing in terms of copyright by signing up... nor do transcriptions "spoil" comics behind a subscription wall.
While I won't disclose the full business plan, it's based on the booming search advertising market. Ads will hit that balance of unobtrusiveness and effectiveness-- we have ten years of search engine history to show us how.
Transcriptions are useful guides to a webcomic's content but nothing like the experience of actually reading one, and we make no more claims to copyright than Google does when it indexes a site. So you risk nothing in terms of copyright by signing up... nor do transcriptions "spoil" comics behind a subscription wall.
While I won't disclose the full business plan, it's based on the booming search advertising market. Ads will hit that balance of unobtrusiveness and effectiveness-- we have ten years of search engine history to show us how.
What's to prevent Google from learning from your efforts and simply duplicating them? They've got the $ to do it and search is their core business.
Also, the copyright status of the transcriptions is actually a tricky question. If you haven't already, you should consult an attorney, and you should be wary of giving legal advice to the comic authors. The only safe thing is to advise them to consult their own attorneys.
There might be alternative ways of structuring the rights that would better protect you from a Google-stomping.
Also, the copyright status of the transcriptions is actually a tricky question. If you haven't already, you should consult an attorney, and you should be wary of giving legal advice to the comic authors. The only safe thing is to advise them to consult their own attorneys.
There might be alternative ways of structuring the rights that would better protect you from a Google-stomping.
Do you write scripts on a word processor?
Ballpoint pen on whatever piece of paper I had handy at the time
Ballpoint pen on whatever piece of paper I had handy at the time
Boalt Hall Law Student:
The irony of your first concern-- which doesn't invalidate it-- is that Ryan and I were directly responding to Google's comics-illiteracy. I think that illiteracy will remain in place for a while, due to limitations in OCR programs. As for Google duplicating our efforts directly, they have a traditional skittishness about any search solution that depends on human behavior, as distributed transcriptions do.
But even if Google takes up our methods and concentrates on our destruction and achieves it, we win. The CAUSE wins.
Copyright is a fair point. IANAL. Let's try this: OhNoRobot makes no claims to the copyright of info on any site which we serve.
The irony of your first concern-- which doesn't invalidate it-- is that Ryan and I were directly responding to Google's comics-illiteracy. I think that illiteracy will remain in place for a while, due to limitations in OCR programs. As for Google duplicating our efforts directly, they have a traditional skittishness about any search solution that depends on human behavior, as distributed transcriptions do.
But even if Google takes up our methods and concentrates on our destruction and achieves it, we win. The CAUSE wins.
Copyright is a fair point. IANAL. Let's try this: OhNoRobot makes no claims to the copyright of info on any site which we serve.
William G... depends on your handwriting to some degree, but you may want to run your script thru an OCR program and see what comes out.
Beyond that, you can always put the code on your site. Hey, you never know...
Beyond that, you can always put the code on your site. Hey, you never know...
Re: The copyright-safeness of OhNoRobot--
On further consideration, I'm an idiot:
http://www.ohnorobot.com/tos.pl
(Much the same policy as Yahoo's.)
On further consideration, I'm an idiot:
http://www.ohnorobot.com/tos.pl
(Much the same policy as Yahoo's.)
We tend to regard transcriptions as the best way to convey the information in most comics through search.
And your comics aren't THAT wordy, G. I've READ them. Pete ABRAMS is wordy.
That said, some information is better than no information... if you meta-describe your comics now I think it'll pay off, and not just through OhNoRobot, but through ONR too.
And your comics aren't THAT wordy, G. I've READ them. Pete ABRAMS is wordy.
That said, some information is better than no information... if you meta-describe your comics now I think it'll pay off, and not just through OhNoRobot, but through ONR too.
is Google able to index the ONR content? (ie - a search on Google for 'bitch scale' would also bring up the P&A transcription on the recent strip)
No, but one of the things we're working on is a way to export the data back to existing webpages as text, so that Google and other search engines can read it that way. (We can already export it as a simple database.)
This'll require a pretty close collaboration between ONR and the strip in question, but I think the benefits will be obvious.
This'll require a pretty close collaboration between ONR and the strip in question, but I think the benefits will be obvious.
Yes it is. http://www.ohnorobot.com/ → http://www.ohnorobot.com/series.pl → http://www.ohnorobot.com/index.pl?comic=57 → http://www.ohnorobot.com/archive.pl?comic=57. There is no robots.txt and no meta tags in the individual pages to prevent Google from seeing everything.
Ryan pointed out something along those lines to me almost at the same time you did.
I'm not sure if xmung was asking for that or if he was asking for a direct link from Google to the scripts in question. I'm also a bit uncertain whether Google *will* index the numbered ONR content just because it *can.* (A link from the comic in question to the ONR transcription guide may help.)
Still, this is good news and one more reason to get involved.
I'm not sure if xmung was asking for that or if he was asking for a direct link from Google to the scripts in question. I'm also a bit uncertain whether Google *will* index the numbered ONR content just because it *can.* (A link from the comic in question to the ONR transcription guide may help.)
Still, this is good news and one more reason to get involved.
Holy crud. In between the two times I've tested tonight, Google's indexed what looks an awful lot like ALL the archives on OhNoRobot.
Um. Yeah.
Yeah. It's looking like this is a good route into Google, all right.
I knew they were fast, but I didn't think they were gonna be THAT fast.
Um. Yeah.
Yeah. It's looking like this is a good route into Google, all right.
I knew they were fast, but I didn't think they were gonna be THAT fast.
If you look at Google's cached copies you can see that a) they last visited on November 29 b) they discard everything beyond the first 512 KB of each page.
If you want search engines to be able to find your comics, you'll need to have text linked to it.
And I'm not talking meta tags.
You can pain-stakingly write transcripts that you'll post with your comic (which, of course, has a nicely formated, significant URL).
I expect this wouldn't work with most comic authors as creative people tend to be less organized and tend to dislike tedious repetitive tasks.
Another way to go is to post some text that reflects the idea of your comic, trying to expand the vocabulary with synonims and related words (this is what Google likes).
And you can flex your creative writing skills too, which should appeal to more artists :)
I'm *starting* to get a hang of this and it's showing interresting results (at least on google).
Then again, I've got somewhat of a niche. Not to many competition on "bear bell zombie comic" or "angry powerless zombie comic"
And I'm not talking meta tags.
You can pain-stakingly write transcripts that you'll post with your comic (which, of course, has a nicely formated, significant URL).
I expect this wouldn't work with most comic authors as creative people tend to be less organized and tend to dislike tedious repetitive tasks.
Another way to go is to post some text that reflects the idea of your comic, trying to expand the vocabulary with synonims and related words (this is what Google likes).
And you can flex your creative writing skills too, which should appeal to more artists :)
I'm *starting* to get a hang of this and it's showing interresting results (at least on google).
Then again, I've got somewhat of a niche. Not to many competition on "bear bell zombie comic" or "angry powerless zombie comic"
Anonymous, other people (like Google Video) are looking into that and they're likely to move faster than we can. No service works really well yet, but if Google's improves we might try a GVideo-OhNoRobot mashup.
Eric, the way the transcriptions go now should go a long way toward helping out with making your own pages Google-friendly. The whole idea behind distributed transcription is that many hands make light work.
Eric, the way the transcriptions go now should go a long way toward helping out with making your own pages Google-friendly. The whole idea behind distributed transcription is that many hands make light work.
Nothing stopping you from entering all the transcriptions yourself. You're the only one who can approve them, anyway...
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